Friday, July 18, 2014

ATF: A Great Loss

How does a .22 caliber 70 grain bullet rolling at about 3100 fps sound?  In case you're keeping track that's hotter than a .223.  What I'm talking about of course is the 5.6x52mmR... otherwise known as the Savage .22 Hi Power... or .22 Imp.  I don't know about you but it sounds pretty damned nice to me.

This round was developed by Savage in 1912, and believe it or not initially became extremely popular among soft skinned dangerous game hunters...  you know... lions and tigers and such.  Looking back that probably wasn't a good idea...  I do believe several folks died because they only wounded the critters.

Still... this has a lot going for it.  It is an extremely accurate round... and its over the magic 3000fps mark.

It fell out of favor here in the US ...  but its still popular in europe I believe.  Anyway.. I dunno about you but I'd like to have one.

A: Woodford Reserve.  Just because.  Dammit.

T:  Gurkha.  As usual.

F:  Hrm...  I figure I better go with the Tracker seven shot .357.  Its been that kind of week around here.

How about you?

48 comments:

Outlaw X said...

I was just thinking about a certain Sako 222 mag. Love that gun older than me.

Nate said...

222 mag... 55 grain bullet... what... 3300fps? yeah baby... yeah!

Giraffe said...

Well, there is the .22-250. Which is well loved by many, including our own Outlaw and myself. It is generally not chambered in barrels that have enough twist for heavy bullets, but you should be able to order a custom barrel and put it on a savage. Hodgdon has data that shows it getting up to 3500 fps with a 70 grain and Superformance powder. Other powders in the 3100 to 3300 range.

But I suppose one wants what one wants.

Res Ipsa said...

I don't know everything going on in the European arms industry, but I do know that the advent of the 6.5x47 Lupua has been a bonus for shooters. 105 grn bullets at 3100 fps and better. The 6.5x47 is dead nuts accurate. The 95 grn are even faster.

WaterBoy said...

Funny...had dinner with a friend from out of town the other night. He has a hobby assembling custom guns, and couldn't stop raving about the .338 Lapua for both hunting and long distance match shooting.

So what's the deal? Is it that greatly accurate a round?

Outlaw X said...

My father used a red seal ten dollar bill as bedding between the stock an barrel folded in half long ways on that Sako. It's still in there. I wonder what that bill is worth?

Res Ipsa said...

So what's the deal? Is it that greatly accurate a round?

The folks at Lupua have done some good work the last several years. The 6.5X47 Lupua is one of the most accurate rounds available today. It doesn't have anywhere near the power of the 338, or the potential distance either. It's hard to make a call on "best round". It depends what the criteria is.

"Custom" guns are a topic in and of themselves. I've built 3. Each one had a specific role to fill. Each one does what it was designed to do better than an off the shelf gun would have done for me. Depending on what/how/where etc that your gun maker friend is using for his criteria the 338 may be the answer for his question.

The 338 will knock a moose or an elk on its butt at 1,200 yards. So will a 7mm-SAUM. The 7SAUM will do it with less powder and a greater selection of bullets. The 338 will do it with a 250 grain bullet. That gives it a tremendous advantage over my favorite 7mm bullet, the 162 grain Amax. 92 extra grains of mass hitting an animal imparts a lot more energy. I doubt a piece of paper knows the difference.

If you think the 338 Lupua is cool. Check out the specs on the 338 Snipe-tac, or the 375 Snipe-tac.

Anonymous said...

Just FYI, Nate - 16 big-ass Gurkhas for $40, shipped. Til midnight tonight.

http://www.cigarsinternational.com/specials/1-day-deal/

Toothy

Ralph the Singer said...


Alcohol: Pabst, winner of medals.

Tobacco: homegrown, hand-rolled. stick that in your mouth and smoke it.

Folding Blade: Kershaw Cryo 2. They make em in China now, but I like that it's all metal and flips out something quick. A gift from a girl.

Add-ons

Finances: Gold, American Eagles. A favorite.

Song: Frank Sinatra, Come Fly With Me.

Susan said...

Don't know if you will see this comment Nate, but on this fine Sunday morning I have come to a conclusion.

After reading some comments by PH who claims to be Southern, all I could think was how you Nate, along with JACIII and Outlaw, have set a really high bar for what it means to be Southron. And while reading the comments by this other nut, he just reinforces the stereotype that has developed for Yanks over the years.

It was never more clear than today, reading those comments by PH. By the way, watching Tom K take him apart was like watching Bane toying with his prey before he totally destroyed them. Epic entertainment for a Sunday morning.

WaterBoy said...

Susan: "After reading some comments by PH who claims to be Southern"

Susan, I think you misunderstood. When PH said "Yanks", it was because he was British/Irish/Australian. To many people outside the US, all Americans are "Yanks". Though it seems he lives in the US now, it appears he originally came from Britain/Ireland/Australia.

Here is the classic saying attributed to E.B. White:

"To foreigners, a Yankee is an American.
To Americans, a Yankee is a Northerner.
To Northerners, a Yankee is an Easterner.
To Easterners, a Yankee is a New Englander.
To New Englanders, a Yankee is a Vermonter.
And in Vermont, a Yankee is somebody who eats pie for breakfast.
"

Susan said...

WaterBoy

The comments he made about yanks and their teaching the South about rights was what made me wonder in the first place. Ozzie guys don't usually invoke the North/South issue unless they have a hunting dog involved.

But you know what? If he is an Ozzie, compared to our beloved rogue JamieR, PH is just a doofus. JamieR is to me, what an Ozzie is all about.

And I would like to know what the heck is wrong with pie for breakfast??? I make several very good savory pies that are better than regular quiche. Not being allowed to eat pie for breakfast is just goofy.

everybodyhatesscott said...

A: Beam
T: E-cig (I know...)
F: S&W Shield

Does toothy have a blog?

Also, thanks to the suggestions here, picked up a smith 686 too.

WaterBoy said...

Susan: " Ozzie guys don't usually invoke the North/South issue unless they have a hunting dog involved."

There are other clues, but these two comments are the most relevant:

"Is that what your ancestors fought for? If King George III had nukes you'd say "ah, well, ok, England is a fairly responsible state whereas we are full of renegades and vagabonds. They win.""

and:

"They're your ancestors, Kratman, not mine."

Going back over it a little closer now, there are other comments that make me think he's Australian and still living there. The mention of "stolen land" was probably due to Aboriginal compensation.

But the "Yanks" thing was not North/South. And there's not a darn thing wrong with pie for breakfast. :)

Susan said...

WaterBoy, I missed the King George comment.

Anything that has the same ingredients as pancakes and waffles is fair game in my book for breakfast.

patrick kelly said...

I've eaten pecan pie for breakfast quite often. Nothin' yankee about that.......

cheddarman said...

speaking about north/south issues, it sure is a damn cold summer up here in Yankee land. Some people are even saying we are headed into a new ice age. Bad news for Nate, as there will plenty more Yankees down south to steal all the salt and pepper shakers from the restaurants...on the upside, the Southron deer will get bigger with colder temperatures.

Anonymous said...

A: Sam Adams Porchrocker
T: Gurkha Titan
F: H and R single shot I paid 20 bucks for years ago.

toothy

ps - POST SOMETHING DAMMIT!

pps - please forgive my previous outburst.

Anonymous said...

Sorry. The H and R is a 12ga.

toothy

Anonymous said...

A: Blanton's
T: Nub Cameroon
F: Springfield XDS 45

Did you and Stilicho go shooting cheddarman?

Toothy

cheddarman said...

Toothy,

We went shootin' i am joining his range club.

I still plan on making it up to defiance some time.

sincerely

cheddarman

cheddarman said...

Toothy,

We went shootin' i am joining his range club.

I still plan on making it up to defiance some time.

sincerely

cheddarman

cheddarman said...

Meet the “9 mm Nate” by Partisan Arms, available in 8 shot revolver with 12” barrel. The cylinder/barrel clearance is less than 0.5 mm, to prevent fire scorching of the barrel

Q: What is the 9 mm Nate? A: 44 magnum case necked down to accept a 9 mm bullet
Q: Why the new cartridge? A: Because the 9 mm parabellum is for fags and girls. This is the first truly kick ass cartridge in 9 mm.
Q: How fast is this cartridge? A: Damn fast, but still not quite fast enough, though we are working on it

Warning: Do not fire this cartridge from a moving motorcycle, especially after consuming alcohol

Anonymous said...

A: Sierra Nevada Kellerweis Hefeweizen

T: Man O War Ruination

F: H&R 922 revolver

What are you smoking?

Toothy

Anonymous said...

A 44 necked down to a 9mm? Interesting...

Toothy

Anonymous said...

Anyone shot the 22 TCM yet? That's an interesting pistol round in itself. And one can easily convert the pistol to 9mm w/a barrel swap.

Toothy

Athor Pel said...

Nate,

Don't you have guest posts to put up? I know you have at least one.

I mean, it's been about two weeks without any of your own posts.

(knock knock knock... anybody home?)

Mark Andrew Edwards said...

Came across your site from your profile on Voxday.

Good stuff here! I wasn't aware of 5.6x52mmR. Intriguing. It would be interesting to try one out. Which rifles chambered this cartridge?

cheddarman said...

to fill out the Nate line of modified pistol cartidges, I would suggest the following:

A .357 necked down to a .22 could as the "mini-Nate" pistol round.

A 50 caliber BMG cut off at about 1.7 inches from the base and necked down to a 40 caliber as the mighty-Nate pistol round.

Get a workin' on that, Mr. Partisan Arms! I want to see some products!

Hopefully Outlaw-x could do some calculations on the probable ballistics for each one

cheddarman said...

I would not recommend loading any of the Nate cartridges with self defense bullets, as the enhanced fragmentation capabilities of these bullets may cause them to disintegrate at the extremely high velocities associated with the cartridges.

Russ said...

Ultimate 9mm cartridge is Russian 9x53. Is best. Kill bear no problem. Got bear? Boosh! Now bear gone. Don't like drone over heads of people? Shoot drone with 9x53. Drone gone Tovarish.

JWilly said...

I am a new gun owner. I own a REM 870 12-gauge, a .22 rifle, and a SA XD-45. My dad did not own any guns and was not (obviously) a hunter. Are there good book recommendations about guns to get me started to go along with actually shooting?

Anonymous said...

A: Leinenkugles Summer Shandy - I think Vox would like it....

T: Gurkha European Select Maduro

F: Oh my! My wife just got me a brand new Ruger Vaquero Bisley 357 Mag. It is shiny! My only single action center-fire revolver I own.

JWilly - Find someone personally knowledgeable about firearms and have them go through the basics and take you shooting a few times.

If they don't know who Jeff Cooper is and his safety rules, move on...

Toothy

Anonymous said...

And I'm upgrading to Russel's Reserve after the Summer Shandy is gone...

I bought the first bottle in Defiance.

Yours in Defiance,

Toothy

Anonymous said...

I even got leather with the 357.
My wife is awesome.

Toothy

Stilicho said...

Nate, what model was that taurus 1911 you liked so much?

Stilicho said...

Toothy, we need to do a defiance trip at some point if only to check out the stocks of the official arms dealer to the Dread Ilk. We also need to get a range day on. Nate and jaciii are invited, but probably won't show.

stilicho said...

Res ipsa, 105 grains? How's that perform on game at various ranges? Good velocity, and I can see how it would work for targets but what happens when the rubber meets the road?

Raggededge said...

Stilicho,

Taurus PT1911

Res Ipsa said...

Stilicho,

I have a 297 yard antelope one shot kill from a specialty pistol with the 123 grain. Hart shot went through both shoulders. I'm trying for a longer kill but I get impatient and only have so many hunting days/year. I've never used the 105's for game. Prairie dogs die when splatted with the 105, but I've not tired them on anything bigger. I don't know why the 105 wouldn't kill deer/antelope. It seems to work just fine in 243. I just haven't tried it.

Partisan Arms said...

That would be cool, Stilicho.

And for anyone that is interested, CI has the Special Ops back in stock w/knife and case: Special Ops

cheddarman said...

Nate,

we know you are out kickin' ass somewhere, but the favor of an update would be greatly and sincerely appreciated by the mortals.

Sincerely

cheddarman

Anonymous said...

Howdy, cheds.

Toothy

Cheddarman said...

Howdy Toothy...me and Stilicho need to come up and check out your store some time soon









Anonymous said...

I'd like that, cheddarman.

Nate, any chance the ATF show will make it back? I truly miss you and Six discussing... stuff.

Toothy

Anonymous said...

A banner day for the toothmeister -

I made Vox Day LOL and Nate say I said something better than him (we use the Kimber/Harley bit all the time at the gunshop, but only because it is true; their magazines are shit too, just FYI).

Kimber, like Harley, has a great marketing dept. and is over the top on aesthetics. Pretty, shiny, great ads, not particularly superior in practical application. Their ads in the NRA mags make me drool, but I know better.

Full disclosure: I shoot bullseye competition with a lower end stainless Kimber because I shoot better with it than my Colt gold cup 80 series. It's a decent 1911, but it's not magical, and the Gold Cup is prettier. And if you get a Kimber with problems... yeesh!

And yes, I'm a infrequent drive-by commenter at VD's site, so I use whatever name comes to mind at the time (I only post as toothy here). Vox can see my IP addy anyway, so he can shitcan me whenever he desires.

A: Bulleit 95 Rye

T: Onyx - Reasonably priced, and tasty!

F: Kimber Stainless Classic w/Ultradot Matchdot scope

K: Pro-Tech Godfather

Now, about that ATF show...

Toothy

bw said...

but its still popular in europe I believe

The ONLY thing popular in Europe is supplication and submission.

Trần Văn Quảng said...

Dịch vụ Kiem tra ten mien miễn phí của inet. Giúp bạn kiểm tra tên miền một cách nhanh nhất
Công cụ Tao web mien phi với webtin. Nhanh chóng, chuyên nghiệp chúng tôi còn cung cấp các gói thiết kế web bán hàng chuyên nghiệp giá rẻ
Chuyên trang cung cấp Meo vat hằng ngày. Chia sẻ những mẹo hay trong cuộc sống giúp cuộc sống của bạn thú vị hơn
Đăng ký nhận Ten mien mien phi từ inet. Bạn có cơ hội sở hữu các tên miền quốc tế với giá 0đ
Dien dan hoc seo nơi chia sẻ kiến thức SEO từ cơ bản đến nâng cao
Cập nhật Tin bóng đá nhanh nhất, chính xác nhất. Thông tin các trận đấu bóng đá, thông tin bên lề
Natural bedding sets