Friday, November 15, 2013

ATF: No.

Sorry kids...  been in the woods all day... gonna be in the woods all day tomorrow.  I'm on a mission to help my boy get his first deer... and that probably means getting up at 0 Dark 30.  Its not that I don't love y'all.   Its just...   priorities dammit.

I will say this...  Jeb and I were both pissed about being rained out... so getting to blow that armadillo to hell and gone was seriously cathartic.

A:  New Castle Cabbie Black Ale.    Holy Shit.   Find some.

T:  Not until a damned deer dies.

F:  HR Handi-Rifle in .223.  Single shot.  Trigger is crisp but its to heavy.  Jeb's still the devil with it.  I'm taking my crossbow with me.  I won't shoot until Jeb get's his... but after that... well....


Raggededge said...

Well, I posted photographic evidence of my buck I last week's ATF. Of course, I cheated. We are in full rut here in Middle Tennessee, so it's basically shooting fish in a barrel.

Good luck tomorrow, my 10 yr old killed his first deer this season. Did it with a 223, no issues. Shot him in the lung and he staggered about 5 yards before he collapsed. Dressing him was a bit messy, bullet didn't go clean through, so lots of blood. Of course, to a 10 year old boy, that is not a real negative.

A: 2008 Switchback Ridge Cabernet

T: Nada

F: Steyr AUG

Nate said...

I watched deer shot with .223 in videos for about 3 days straight before I finally decided it would be ok for Jeb.

I would rather him be shooting a 7mm-08... but here's the thing... Jeb is extremely confident with that little .223. He's shot it a lot... and he's very... very good with it. And he knows he's good with it.

You just can't replace that.

Vidad said...

A: Jack
T: La Floridita Dominica torpedo
F: Just a machete today. British-made. Awesome.

Russ said...

A: Maker's.
T: Marco V platinum. Superb.
F: My old AR-15 carbine which is just sitting on my lap as I write this. Am I the only one who always has a gun or two at the desk? Oh yeah, and the tomahawk what done killed the stupid rabbit.

Russ said...

Oh yeah, and is it just me, or does Elijah Craig cost way to much for what you get?

Nate said...

elijah craig 12 is terrible. just... terrible. The fact that its expensive just makes the terrible.. more terrible.

Nate said...

also... I would imagine just about everyone round these parts has guns at the desk.

Raggededge said...

Well? Did Jeb get him one?

Vidad said...

"guns at the desk"

Yes. And behind it. And in my room. And behind the bed. And on my dresser. And the closet.

Outlaw X said...

Here's a gun buy a license and go deer hunting. Most young people don't have a father in the hunting sense, and most of them are ignorant. I was returning from where I was hunting and my cousins always looked to me as a father in the hunting sense. I found my cousin waving his hands trying to get me to stop, he is 15 year younger than me. Now ten years ago I taught him a good lesson about hunting .

He said he shot a der with his 243 and could find it as it ran off. So I picked my back pack up out of the back of my truck and said let's find him.

So I started asking the usual questions which way did he go where did you shoot him and such. I found out that the deer had walked behind a vertical concrete wall for an oil tank and only his ass was showing so he shot him in the ass.

It was 11:00 AM in the morning and was pissed for him doing it and told him we got two beers to drink and you can forget lunch we are going to look until dark. His excitement turned to lament.

Any way I did track the deer down about 1/2 mile in the woods across a creek in about two hours. And we got within 25 ft of him and my cousin couldn't see him and I told him to look around an find him. He was still alive and had his head up laying in the brush. He finally saw him and I told him to rest his rifle against a tree and shoot him in the head. He did.

Then I handed him my knife and told him to gut him and made him do it by himself. He didn't like it but I told him you are going to have to drag that deer 1/4 mile across the creek before we can pick him up with my pickup.

By the the time we got out of the woods he was completely worn out as I refused to help him because he shot him in the ass.

As we were walking back to my truck to come back and pick the deer up with blood up to elbows I handed him a beer out of my back pack and he said I won't ever do that again.

Good to see you are teaching your child how to hunt.

Nate said...

jeb took a clean shot on a big doe from about 60 yards. hammered her right in the shoulder. Just blasted it. Deer came straight up off the ground and the should sunk in like it had been hit with a sledge hammer. it hit the ground like it had a broken leg but still managed to gather itself an haul ass off. We gave it 15 minutes or so and went out but by that time is was to dark... we couldn't see shit. to cloudy... even with the full moon. Jeb was SO pissed... but at some point you just have to call it off.

Outlaw X said...

What did he shoot it with, Nate?

Vidad said...

Tell Jeb he's still cooler than most kids - good for him.

When I was a kid we made blowguns. Nasty, dangerous ones from galvanized electric conduit, masking tape and wire clotheshanger pieces that had been sharpened to needle points on a grinding wheel.

We decided to take them and hunt fish beneath the I-95 bridge. There were often needlenosed gar and other weird creatures there. We got up on one of the pilings and waited for a victim. Eventually, a decent gar came along near the surface and "TWIFFFFT!" I nailed it.

Unfortunately, it kept swimming with my 6" dart sticking in its back. We hadn't really worked out a proper recovery system...

Vidad said...

Great story, Outlaw.

"By the the time we got out of the woods he was completely worn out as I refused to help him because he shot him in the ass."

That should be on a T-shirt.

Outlaw X said...

I teach, always be ready for the deer to get up, keep the scope on him and if he does shoot again.

Outlaw X said...

Vidad shooting gar with a stick bow an a bow reel is damn fun on the Red River.

Nate said...

He shot it with barnes vor-tx solid copper. Single shot .223. So quick follow up isn't an option.

Nate said...

Also... Outlaw... you the boy shot in the back legs?

or are we talking about a texas heart shot here?

I've seen deer shot straight up through the asshole and out the chest.

Outlaw X said...

I shoot them in the heart or the head if that's' what your asking. The only thing I will shoot in the butt or up the butt is vermin like skunks coyotes, hogs, ect..

I'd get away from the solid copper bullets they won't cause hydric shock like a cooper coated lead JHP or an Amax. That's why people don't go hunting with FMJ's.

Outlaw X said...

Did you and Jeb look for him anymore?

Nate said...

just got back... had 4 of us looking today... no joy. then he we hit the blinds about 1530... and sat until just past sundown. nothing. didn't even see damned birds.

Outlaw X said...

Sorry to hear you didn't find him I am sure Jeb is disappointed. I don't mean to as ass or tell you what to do but have a couple of suggestions. Find a picture of a deer standing broadside and print it out. Take a thin red marker but any color would suffice and draw a little circle about 6" behind the shoulder and put cross hairs in the circle then pen it up on his wall or bulletin board and tell him to memorize it. Then Get him some lead .223 bullets JSP, JHP or preferably Amax bullets (especially for a deer with a .223). and under 200 yards if he hits there that deer will not get up and run it will fall and at the most start kicking his legs on the ground. Get rid of those solid copper bullets they tend to go through an animal instead of exploding in the chest cavity causing severe organ damage. And any time a bullet goes through an animal it mean some of the energy left out the other side. My little Bro tried solid copper bullets hog hunting and they all ran away but when he went back to soft point Lead they never went more than 50 yards.

Outlaw X said...

Another thing Nate I believe that dear will not die of its wounds since you couldn't find him. With a copper bullet he will die of septic shock.

Outlaw X said...

Deer, not Dear.

Giraffe said...

I think that would be the problem with a .223. If you use a bullet that penetrates, it doesn't make a big entrance hole. I doesn't have enough energy to make a big exit hole. Makes the deer tougher to track.

Not disparaging your choice of gun. It should work.

I had a doe that stopped a barnes triple shock out of a 7mm. That shouldn't happen. It should have enough to go through two deer but it hit both shoulder blades. The deer died in midair. Maybe his bullet stopped in the onside shoulder and didn't get to the lungs.

I haven't had bad luck with barnes triple shocks. They seemed to kill quick as anything. I set that rifle up for longer range so I don't use them anymore, but I may go back to triple shocks in .30-06.

Anyway, thats part of hunting. You hunt long enough, you make a bad shot. Sounds like he made a good shot, and it still didn't work out. That's tough, but stuff happens.

Nate said...

No offense Greg... but I've never seen heart shots drop deer like that.

Certainly not with a .223.

I've shot doe with .308 that liquefied the heart completely.

Damned thing ran 50 years.

Daniel said...

Holy cow, Nate. What kind of deer was that, a Timex?

Nate said...

just a big damned doe. You have to remember how much oxygen the damned things have in their blood already.

You want to drop one on the spot you have 2 options and only 2 options.

1) Head shot.

2) Spine shot.

Now I am not calling anyone a liar here. I am just saying my experience is... heart and lung shots don't drop them on the spot unless you break their shoulders and or break their spine.

A boy I know shot a buck in just behind the shoulder with a 7mm-08. Nice 8 point. Pretty. It ran quite a damned ways... no blood trial at all. no blood anywhere. It wasn't until we started cleaning it that we saw blood. Blood just poured everywhere. Damned heart was totally gone. Just gone. Liquefied.

When they absolutely cannot be allowed to run... I'm either gonna go for a headshot... or I'm going to bring a heavy hitter and go straight through the shoulder into the other shoulder. two smashed front legs... and no lungs or heart.. it ain't likely going far.

Its not a perfect a method as the head or spine shots... but there is a larger margin for error.

Outlaw X said...

No offense Greg... but I've never seen heart shots drop deer like that.

None taken our experiences are different. I just made suggestions on what I have seen.

Only time I had one run aput 50 yards with a heart shot that went through the lungs and heart, was with a 220 swift at 410 yards. the bullet had slowed down so much (60 gr Hornady match JHP) that instead of exploding in the chest cavity came out the other side and didn't find this out until I was cleaning him. All others dropped immediately.

Nate said...

I think a lot of the difference is the distance we're shooting.

We're shooting under 100 yards... and these bullets are mostly just punching holes.

jack said...

OT. I was watching a DVD on the history of the gun last night and the episode about weapons of the Civil War left me with a question. You, of all people, should know.
They mentioned the famous and classic meeting, at Gettysburg, at Little Round Top, between the Alabama 15th., and Chamberlain's 20th. Maine. Now, if there could be one event, at lower unit level, that could have been, whichever side prevailed, the turning point of that war I would vote for the 20th. holding Little Round Top and preventing the Confederate batteries from getting set up there and sweeping the Union flanks with cannon fire.
To your knowledge has anyone written an alternate history where Lee did not make the unbelievable mistake of diverting to Gettysburg from his goad of taking Washington?
I could see Lee doing his primary mission and the South gaining an honorable peace with the Union. Of course, a lot of folk would scream that it would have been the end of American culture on this continent. I think, should there have been an outside threat to the two separate political entities, say, Germany or Japan, the Confederacy and the Union would have joined forces and kicked some major butt.
So, thats the question: Is there a decent alternate history to Less's campaign in 1863? If not, maybe you should write one.

Nate said...

It wasn't Lee's mistake Jack. Lee sent three different letters to Davis asking him permission to take Washington. All three times Davis refused to allow him to do so.

It was on Jefferson Davis. Not Lee.